Is there anything in Bond history worse than the tidal wave scene?


#1

The correct answer is “no”. Prove me wrong.


#2

It depends on your threshold of proof but if balance of probabilities rather than being beyond reasonable doubt, I would suggest that the personal relationship between Bond and Blofeld in SPECTRE is probably worse, on the basis that it is significant to its tale and undermines it all so very badly, rather than a scene that ultimately has no purpose in its story (which I accept is not a tremendous thing).

However, I’m not suggesting I’ve proven you wrong.


#3

2 words…

“Quarrel, shoes.”

At least I can laugh at the tidal wave… from behind the cushion that I’m cringing behind!


#4

Nope…


#5

“A woman?!??”

Forcing himself on Pussy Galore…

…the name Pussy Galore

“Quarrel, feth my shoes”

“Man talk”

“That should keep you in curry”

So yes, my god yes. The tidal wave is silly. There are actually horrendous things in Bond’s history that are far worse than a piece of dodgy cgi.


#6

2 words: Bibi Dahl :laughing:


#7

And that’s in one Moore’s more serious outings…


#8

In principle, the idea of Bond escaping on a tidal wave by using what he has, actually, is very Bondian and clever. If the CGI had been better (the rendering obviously took too much time or money or both so they settled with that pre-version) we would probably like it as much as other exaggerated Bondian escapes.

Does it take me out of the film? No. So it´s not the worst idea in Bond film history, IMO.

Neither do I consider concepts of race superiority or women, due to the zeitgeist of the time the movies were made in, as grave offenders, even if I hate the thinking behind it.

I could even see a good idea hidden in the “Oberhauser was my stepbrother”-concept. But I agree with Jim - the way that was handled definitely was botched in the most disappointing way and therefore is worse than the tidal wave CGI (which remains for me just an unfinished rough cut-scene, while the “I am Blofeld”-torture-scene completely overshadows all the Craig films with an underdeveloped, tagged-on meaning which the stories simply do not support.)


#9

Thing is, I disagree. CR and QOS do support SPECTRE, in the idea of a group behind things (Skyfall doesn’t, but I’m more okay than most letting that slide). It’s only the step brother angle that isn’t properly supported, but that isn’t actually important in the film, it’s just sort of…there. Whilst I do wonder why the hell it was there, I’m more happy that, at no point, is that amazing coincidence used as a shortcut to get from one place to another (as indeed Fleming does in both Goldfinger and Thunderball) Bond actually does an investigation, following leads found in one place to get to another.

M directs Bond to assissinate Sciarra, a known member, to draw other members to the funeral.

Lucia tells Bond where they meet

The Pale King is mentioned at the meeting, which Mi6 has listed as a known alias of the man Bond knows as Mr White

Mr White directs him to get Madeleine to take him to L’American where White has his notes stored.

Bond uses those notes to locate Blofeld’s base.

Blofeld confirms Denbigh works for him.

Bond returns to London to stop what C was doing, having learnt it was all for SPECTRE

At no-point does Bond go anywhere, or do anything, using the coincidence that dropped in his lap (unlike, say, Avatar, which connects the whole film with “what an amazing coincidence…oh look, that’s pretty isn’t it?”)

As for era appropriate, you could argue the introduction of a multi-film arc, which, as I said, does have some groundwork from CR and QOS, is as era appropriate for 2015 (a year in which only Star Wars and Avengers made more money) as a very silly action set piece was in 2002 (hello xXx), or, indeed, any of the aforementioned comments were socially acceptable at the time, regardless of how horrible they are to other sensibilities.


#10

I really only meant the stepbrother-idea which is not supported by any CraigBond before SPECTRE.


#11

I think if we look at this in the context of their times, then the racism and sexism examples given above aren’t that bad. Who knows what lines of dialogue from Craig Bond which seem perfectly innocuous now may be deemed ‘difficult’ in 50 years time!

However, the tidal wave is indeed rubbish in context. The quality of that cgi was no better than the rear projection of an 80s tv show. No excuse for that.

Note: I’m not criticising the idea, just the execution.


#12

It’s not really supported in the film either. It’s just…there. It’s why I can muster up strong feelings either way. Doesn’t actually have any effect.


#13

But the scene was supposed to make people muster up strong feelings. Which is why it failed so badly.

Again, I hope that BOND 25 can out SPECTRE into perspective, turn it into an exposition for a really meaty treatise.


#14

Good luck to them!


#15

So…actually explore that relationship? If that’s actually the idea, I’m even happier CJF is both writing and directing. I have faith he could do that justice. Hodge and Boyle I don’t, but, hey, it’s all a hypothetical at this point, its the final days’ hypotheticals before actual information starts pouring in.


#16

Back to the original topic:

Winking pigeon
Jaws & Dolly
(Both from MR - fancy that)

Tanya Roberts


#17

Jinx’s “Yo mama…” line…enough said! :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:


#18

I like that line, also the concept of being childishly flippant during torture, which did carry through to the Craig era where Bond displays a similar attitude in more brutal tortures. “The whole worlds going to know you died scratching my balls!”


#19

and of course the winking fish from LTK


#21

Oh God, i’d forgotten about that!